Alexis Pascaris: Well, I like to think this path chose me actually. It’s just a really natural space and I don’t think there’s anything else I’d rather be doing or should be doing. And I think it stems from a place of outrage and environmental injustice and heartbreak about the way modern man relates to the natural world. I feel like I have to protect and preserve what’s sacred. So by pursuing environmental science, I feel like It’s the most direct pathway to gain the skill set and build my capacity to create sustained change.

Cody Sanford: This is the Livable Future Podcast. My name is Cody Sanford. 

Kaydee Barker: And I’m Kaydee Barker. This is a special episode of the Livable Future Podcast in partnership with the Yeah! Environmental Alliance and Higher Education. And you can actually go back to our first and second episodes where we introduce YEAH and what it is if you’re interested.

We would just like to take a moment to acknowledge that we are creating this podcast on lands that were the traditional and ancestral homelands of the Ute, Arapaho, and Cheyenne people. We would like to honor these people and their contributions to this region.

CS: Thank you for reading the land acknowledgment, Kaydee. I recently sat down with other young environmentalists and we had a frank discussion about the challenges and hopes we have as environmentalists facing an uphill battle. Let’s get into it. So today I am joined by a number of fellows from the Youth Environmental Alliance in Higher Education. If you could go around and introduce yourselves.

Alexis Pascaris: Hey, thanks for having me Cody. My name is Alexis Pascaris. I’m the Clean Energy Policy Specialist at the Groundwork Center for Resilient Communities in Northwest Michigan

Keegan Schealer: Hey, how’s it going? Thanks for having us on, Cody. My name is Keegan Schealer. I’m a senior at Moravian University. 

Charles Doktycz: Hi, I’m Charles Doktycz. Thanks for having us on. I am a Ph.D. candidate at Vanderbilt University. 

Jacob Genuise: Hi, my name is Jacob Genuise. I’m a master’s student in Ecosystem Science and Sustainability at Colorado State University. 

Sarah Viders: Hi, I’m Sarah Viders. I go to Colorado State University and I’m an undergrad studying Ecosystem Science and Sustainability.

CS: Alexis, Keegan, Charles, Jacob, and Sarah, thank you so much for coming on the Livable Future Podcast. I wanna start with the question, why did you choose a degree in the environmental sciences? Charles, can you go first?

CD: I guess for myself, I had a bit of a sidestepping journey to get to environmental sciences. I started in strict sciences with chemistry and kind of wasn’t quite sure what I wanted to get into and continued on through undergrad and graduate school until I finally kind of found the perfect spot to combine my passion for the environment along with my science background where, and my goal of getting an engineering degree to kind of end up at civil and environmental engineering. 

JG: I can hop in, and I think I have a similar kind of path to Charles a little bit. So we started out undergrad in meteorology. So very strict science and a lot of math. And I was just missing the people component. We weren’t talking about people enough and the impacts on other people. So I started getting interested in disaster recovery efforts and how those efforts are funded and how equitable that funding can be. And so that kind of led me into environmental science because I think it’s kind of the perfect crossroads between people and science, you know, you can’t talk about the environment without talking about the people and vice versa. So it’s kind of what brought me to environmental science. 

AP: That’s awesome, Jacob. Thank you for sharing. I guess I chose this path chose me actually. It’s just really natural space and I don’t think there’s anything else I’d rather be doing or should be doing. And I think it stems from a place of outrage and environmental injustice and heartbreak about the way modern man relates to the natural world. I feel like I have to protect and preserve what’s sacred. So by pursuing environmental science, I feel like…It’s the most direct pathway to gain the skill set and build my capacity to create sustained change. 

KS: I can hop in next, that was great. For me, I’ve just always loved being out in nature ever since I was a kid. So when I had the option to take environmental science classes in high school, I was super intrigued. And ever since then, I’ve just been motivated to try and protect the natural beauty of our planet, which is why I majored in environmental policy and economics. It’s kind of a broad area of research, but it can be specific. But I’m just hoping that the knowledge I can gain can help me transform my passion into action. I’m not sure exactly where I want to end up yet. You know, similar to Charles, I am interested in sustainability. So maybe some form of sustainability consulting in the future, but I’m not totally narrowed down yet. 

SV: Yeah, and I can go next. I have a similar feeling to Alexis, I was a chemistry major when I first came into Colorado State University and I was at freshman orientation and they handed me my class schedule and it was going to be 12 math credits just to catch up to what I needed and you know I was like this doesn’t feel right. So I actually took CSU’s online major quiz and it picked out ecosystem science and sustainability and since I read that that major was an option at CSU, it’s just been the perfect major for me. And it’s helped me figure out that I wanna go to law school and become an environmental lawyer because that’s how I think I can best use my voice for the environment. 

CS: Well, thank you all again for coming on the Livable Future Podcast. You’re all clearly intelligent young people. Now I want to get into the meat of it. As an environmentalist, it’s an uphill battle to get to make progress. So where are you finding light, hope, optimism in this uncertain climate change-ridden world?

CD: I, I guess personally for me, this might be a pretty common answer considering where the youth voice for this, but in truth, it’s how my generation and younger generations approach the problem. I think what Alexis said was very powerful and that’s similar sentiment that I feel as well as seeing how humans currently relate to the environment. That relationship is, I mean, just hard to see at times, but with my friends, and maybe it’s biased from who I surround myself with, how they treat that and how they’re willing to or how they see that as a bad thing and how they do want to shape this and move forward and live a sustainable future is something that gives me hope that it’s not as much waiting something out. It’s that that action is coming and we’re working on it. And there is a timeline where we will have a more sustainable options for ourselves

CS: Charles, Great point. And I just want to add my two cents in. I live in Fort Collins, Colorado. This is known as a sustainable city and having the options on a community level to enact a sustainable lifestyle is so important for me to have a more optimistic lens about the future. If we can sort of enact this on a more broad scale, if we can find more and more solutions on a community level, I think that’s a way forward. And I believe we need to get everyone involved here.

AP: I think in instances where we’re changing from individualism to community-centeredness is where there’s hope and where change can happen. So it’s those of us, like the six of us in this room, working together in solidarity and mutuality, sharing resources and building alliances, not only amongst ourselves but at the level of government or perhaps in academia. It’s the community level for me. But also, I draw it down to a deeper level. I also think the hope comes from within the individual human heart first, and then amongst ourselves and that just takes us from the grassroots to the grass tops all the way up. And of course, the most hopeful place for me is the classroom. I think that’s where we can make really impactful change and that’s demonstrated through the YEAH Network.

KS: You know, similar to Alexis and Charles, I think the youth voices that we’re seeing in the YEAH Network really are inspiring to me. You know, some days I do struggle with this concept of having hope because it is, you know, it is really hard, especially now with COVID, you know, wildfires in the West Coast, oil spills in the Gulf. But at the end of the day, you do see the activists all over the world, especially now with social media to being able to post you know the Fridays for the future like Greta’s doing, and people are just out there educating themselves on these issues more than before. So, I know that our grandparents’ generations, they weren’t really too, they weren’t really focused on protecting our environment. They didn’t really try to educate themselves on these issues. Now that people are aware of what’s going on, they are actively trying to learn and engage with activists in these communities, which it really does inspire me. 

SV: Yeah, I would definitely have to agree with all of you. And I think awareness is really where I’m seeing a lot of hope, people are starting to realize that they should recycle and that summers are getting hotter, that sort of thing, but there’s like a definite awareness and understanding that we are currently in a climate problem and we are starting to feel the impact, sea level rise, you’re seeing it on the news, that sort of thing. And I think because of the accessibility of the internet, we are hearing about the stories of how climate change is impacting other countries that haven’t necessarily done anything to deserve these impacts. And I think people are realizing this and wanting to jump in on these COP conversations and study environmental science and also learn about it. 

CS: So next I wanna ask, what systemic problems do you believe we need to be focusing on right now to get to a better sustainable, livable future? 

AP: That’s a heavy question, Cody. 

CS: I know, but like it’s so deep that it’s there’s so many ways that you can head with this. 

AP: For sure. Well, I guess I’ll start with the often contention contentious but ever important population bomb problem. I mean, it’s the root of many of our wicked problems and we’ve simply outgrown our nest. We’re exhausting our natural resources faster than the earth can replenish them. But I won’t dig there. I think I’d rather focus on addressing systemic problems related to energy politics and unsustainable agriculture. So I guess in terms of energy, I think the problem is the corrupt relationship between politics, fossil fuel interests, the commoditization of electricity by investors and utilities, that whole mess. And when it comes to sustainable agriculture, or unsustainable agriculture, I should say, we’ve manipulated our environment to feed this growing population, right? It’s absolutely unsustainable. And what we’re doing now is compromising future generations’ ability to sow their seeds in fertile soils and irrigate with clean water. So I think focusing our energy and our efforts on addressing where and how we produce electricity and where and how we produce agriculture are the two top-level issues for me because we need to feed and fuel our growing population.

KS: Yeah, I think Alexis makes some great points. I also think it comes down to our economic institutions as well, because ultimately we do live in this capitalistic society with industries that take advantage of and exploit all their natural resources. I think once we start assigning a value to our ecosystem services, whether it’s pollination or water filtration or however, we need to assign a tax and emissions as well or do something to make these big corporations start to care about what they’re doing, which is sad because we shouldn’t have to go there. It should be just instinct for people to care about the environment, but that’s just the world that we live in right now.

SV: To follow off that, I think that another big problem with our world is that we really lack a relationship with the earth. And by that, I mean, you know, we, corporations take what they want, but give nothing back to the planet. You know, there’s no reciprocal give and take when in that sort of regard. And I think it’s  We as corporations and big capitalistic societies kind of have a selfish perspective on the climate and are just kind of doing a pulling a Lorax and just taking as much as we can before there’s nothing left and trying to benefit ourselves as much as possible and I think that if we can try to attack greed and the economic problems in our society, I think that’s a good way to start.

JG: I think I’m gonna take the kind of, I guess, YEAH stance on this question. I feel like the issue is who, I guess from a policy perspective, who is being invited to not only share their opinion, but whose opinion is being listened to at the end of the day. I feel like there’s been a lot of, oh, we’ll let you speak and we’ll let you speak what you think needs to get done. But then the old white man go on to the negotiation table and decide whatever they’re going to do based on whatever financial incentive or whatever other incentive they want to get done. So I think it’s who we’re inviting to the table. I think that’s my systemic issue. And that’s why I think bringing students to COP is so important. These projections we’re seeing of what’s going to happen to our temperature, to our water into the future, these 2050, 2070, these checkpoints in time are years that youth will be alive for, very likely, and will be raising their kids during. And so we see this like very intimately, and I think inviting youth voices into these spaces and actually including them in decisions would be a great issue to solve, I think one of the most important.

CS: Honestly, I think you all nailed a lot of the systemic problems we have that are preventing us from getting to a better future. So my follow-up question is, how are you focusing your present right now to address these systemic problems? Why doesn’t Jacob start this round?

JG: I’ll take the YEAH stance again because it’s important to me. So I’ve never felt more connected to the fight against climate change than when I’m with a group of students who are all connected to that same fight. And I had a really great opportunity in undergrad. I went to undergrad in Oklahoma and we got a student group together to go talk to senators in Oklahoma about energy and about climate change. And we were talking to people in districts were 80% red districts that we weren’t, we didn’t think we’re gonna be receptive to ideas or we’re gonna listen to us. And they did. And to just see the excitement of finding some sort of common ground with these senators on certain small pieces and to see the excitement in the other students and in myself and to kind of collaborate on that, think about how we can push that forward, how we can try to effect change was so, so inspiring. And that’s why I’m happy to be part of, yeah. And that’s why I draw so much energy and so much, you know, I guess back to the other question, optimism from the students we work with. And so, yeah, I’m centering my education around other students and other young people who are, you know, working alongside me.

SV: Yeah, you know, Jacob, I definitely have to agree with you. What comes to mind for me is last summer, I worked for the Colorado Natural Heritage Program and did fieldwork. And I met so many students that are just so passionate about helping climate change and, you know, like caring about animals. And everyone had a slightly different goal. But as a group, we all, you know, can come together to like actually fight climate change. And it really makes me happy that there are so many students in these different opportunities, like, yeah, like the Colorado Natural Heritage Program and students in research labs that are also, you know, learning about how water is changing, how acid is affecting it, you know, river runoff, that sort of thing.

CS: Thank you, Sarah. Keegan, what do you have to say? 

KS: So yeah, just in my major, I’ve been taking some classes pretty broad, I guess you could say from marine biology to environmental ethics, to political theory. Also, I can have this really good base understanding of just what’s going on in the world and how we can address it and solve these issues. And I’m also currently a local climate action planning intern for the Lehigh Valley Planning Commission, which accounts for Lehigh County in Northampton County in Pennsylvania. I’m also working with the DEP in that same little group to conduct a greenhouse gas inventory and to make a climate action plan for the Lehigh Valley in Pennsylvania, like as a whole, which is super cool. So I’m learning a lot about the process of calculating emissions. And hopefully next semester we’ll be putting together a plan for these industries to decrease their overall emissions, which I’m super excited about. And of course, working with, yeah, learning a lot from the PIs Students are here today learning about them even right now, all their experiences and everything. It’s just a super cool experience. I’m super grateful for it.

CD: I was going to say mine is, I’ve got kind of, it’s all Vanderbilt related right now. I think my dissertation occupies about 90% of my time, but it’s, uh, my research is in kind of making the business case for climate change adaptation measures. So looking at the costs of extreme weather events and the addition of those over time and looking at adaptation measures and how that will help reduce those costs and what we’re looking at in the future on different time horizons through the next 100 years. And along with that, I’d plug another project working with the Vanderbilt Climate Change Initiative. I was fortunate enough, I got to go to COP25 and we focused a lot on building tools for educating younger students in building a climate change curriculum for younger students. And one of the things I got to do was interview a bunch of people around the conference. I brought a camera, a microphone, and I’d follow people in no corner and ask them a question and what they would like to tell the youth about climate change. And I got it was amazing. I got all these perspectives around the world and just have developed conversations with them, too. So we put this all together, put it in an app where you can scroll around a map and click on different areas and look at it called Carbon XP. And it kind of had a carbon footprint calculator along with these perspectives. And we kind of used it for a tool to show younger kids what climate change means and what other places around the world want people to know about it. So yeah, I guess a little youth education and then business case scenarios for climate change or where I’m at.

CS: Very neat. Everyone, keep it up. Alexis, have you gone yet?

AP: So I just recently earned my Master of Science in environmental and energy policy from Michigan Technological University. And I went through that endeavor because I wanted to study the machine we call our energy system so that I knew how to approach it, what buttons to press, how to change it, how to make it more resilient and sustainable. So I wanted to engage in policy scholarship because like Jacob said, environmental problems or people problems. Our changing climate is a product of our socio-political dis-ease. So that brought me to my current role as the clean energy policy specialist, which is a fancy word for someone who does community organizing and at a regional level in northwest Michigan. So I’m developing key relationships, building alliances among different local units of government, who all have municipal utilities, which means they’re in charge of their own electrical distribution. So that gives them a lot of power in terms of what type of energy they serve their customers or their residents. So I’m bringing local units of government together with tribal governments and trying to forge these really awesome relationships so that we can cite utility-scale projects in the region. That’s a task in its own, finding where we can put large-scale renewable systems. So, that’s my story. It came from wanting to make a difference in terms of this giant umbrella of renewable energy. And that entailed understanding the mechanisms that influence change, and then going out and knocking on people’s doors and asking them to come to meetings and asking them to do something. It’s a process.

CS: Alexis, Keegan, Sarah, Charles, and Jacob, thank you for doing what you’re doing. We need more agents of change like yourselves and people who are working to make the future a better, more livable place. On that note, I have one final question. And Jacob, if you could start. I wanna ask, are you really optimistic about the future and why? 

JG: I think today in this moment I am. And that might not be true tomorrow. It might not have been true, you know, even a few days ago, but today in this moment I am. And I don’t know, I think those days that you wake up and you’re like, wow, we can do something about this. Like, let’s push forward. Hold onto that and remember those moments too. When, you know, the days that you’re maybe a little more pessimistic. 

AP: Yes. Thank you for saying that Jacob, cause I’m often scared to be like the hardcore environmentalist who has absolutely no hope. Cause then I’m just like, I can’t walk my own talk if that’s how I want to perceive the world. So some days I’m fired up, I’m empowered. I feel engaged and inspired. And some days I just want to like pack my backpack and go into the woods. Cause it’s just too much. And like, it’s a huge problem, just enormous problems. So I’m riding a roller coaster daily, but like Jacob said it’s when you’re on those ups and you feel like we all have a shared sentiment, we all have a shared vision, we all have one earth, one love, right? That’s the direction I wanna move towards and that’s what keeps me moving even when it’s really dark. So yes, I feel optimistic most of the time.

KS: Yeah, I’d say for us as climate scientists, people aware of these issues, it’s, it’s harder because we’re, we know all the bad things that are happening and all the things that can happen in the future. Whereas the people who aren’t as aware, they don’t really know what’s going on. So it’s not, it’s harder for them to worry about something they don’t really know about, which is a challenge. But at the same time, we know all the smart people, all the people who are passionate about making a difference are actually out there working for it us included, which, you know, it can be inspiring. It is hard like we’ve all been talking about, but it’s definitely something that we’re working for and can accomplish.

SV: Yeah, and I think, you know, being able to have a Zoom call with you all and just hear everyone’s opinions and being such a supporting community where everyone, you know, is popping up little reactions to everything we’re all saying, you know, it definitely makes you feel heard and makes you feel optimistic that, you know, we can all bring our voices and be louder than corporations and everything out there that’s trying to drown us out. And it definitely makes me optimistic that there are so many people that are kind and do care and wanna hear your side of the story.

CD:  I’d say I wouldn’t be doing this and spending my graduate career if I wasn’t optimistic about it. 

CS: This episode has been in partnership with the Youth Environmental Alliance in Higher Education. You can learn all about this network by going to the YEAH-net.org website or by listening to our first two episodes of the Livable Future Podcast. You can find us at livablefuturepodcast.com on social media and wherever you subscribe to podcasts. Thanks for listening.